Thinking of breeding?

When I first started four years ago, people told me that ball pythons are easy. Feed them once per week, clean once per week and you are done. Now that I'm breeding, I find there are a lot of things they did not tell me. First, if you are going to have a collection with any size, the rat bills will be very expensive. I spend around $50 - $100 per week in rats. So, you want to breed your own food? That work requires much more attention than the snakes. If you don't clean often, then you will have a very bad smell in your house. I spend more time with the rats than I do the snakes. That ain't fun.

I will spend about twenty minutes every morning before going to work to fill the humidifier, check on breeding pairs or eggs or something and update my records. Then when I come home tired from work, go down to the snake and rat room to spot clean check on what needs done or feed. Then update the whiteboards that track my collection or update feeding cards.

Last weekend, we vended at the show so the weekend was spent preparing for the show, organizing displays, working the show, etc. This weekend, the entire weekend was spent with the snake business - Setting up and organizing racks. Setting up a light box and taking pictures, posting them online for sale, meeting with people who purchased snakes, etc. I love football and didn't get a chance to see hardly ten minutes of a game this weekend.

Now, before you think I'm complaining, I'm not. I love my animals and enjoyed almost every minute with the snakes (however, not the rats). Just wanted to put the bug out there that breeding is not as easy as it sounds. If all it was to breeding was putting a couple of snakes together, it would be easy. If you are thinking of breeding consider you need to update a webpage (html sux), be active on Facebook, meet with buyers, vend at shows, take quality pictures and deal with those stinking rats. Did I tell you I hate rats? :vomit:

Before you decide to breed, think about how much work it really involves. This really is a second job and if I did not love my first job, this one would not be very pleasant. I value time with my friends and family. Sometimes, I have to sacrifice that to take care of the snake farm, or those stinking rats. BTW, even if I sold all of my babies at asking price, I still would be nowhere close to breaking even. It takes years and years before you can actually show a profit - that is if you can hang in there that long. Something to consider if you want to breed more than for a hobby. Now, I've got to go and check on a few snakes to see if they ate.

can u write me back on facebook much easyer for me please i post it on ur wall my name jacob thompson

Jacob, I've responded on Facebook. You can send me a private message through this site or Facebook and I'll give you my cell phone number to contact me. I have one male and two normal females left.

Good stuff Don

Right on Don! I was just thinking this weekend about how much more I care for the rats. I'm starting to think they get more care than my snakes. Good thing I hate football LOL

Rats definitely take more work than the snakes. At some point I will probably get back into breeding my own feeders, but I just don't have the space any more. Not to mention, if you breed your own feeders, get good stock because I didn't and I paid for it. I got mite infested rats with respiratory infections and to top it off, they didn't breed well.

Thanks for posting this Don. How many snakes do you care for? And how many rats?

I have often said that I spend far more time each week caring for rats than I do snakes and people look at me like I'm nuts. I don't enjoy the rats but I know they are a necessary evil if you own more than a few snakes. I think the part I really don't look forward to is dealing with customers. I haven't gotten to that point yet but it coming really soon. To this point I have been buying and breeding for stuff I want. Next spring I will produce enough babies that after I keep what I want I will have to advertise and sell babies. I really don't like the run around of "I'll take it" and then "I don't have the money" or "I can get it cheaper from so and so". I guess it's just another necessary evil of playing the game.

See, I think I would actually enjoy breeding the rats because you can breed rats for color and pattern just like snakes, only they reproduce much faster. When I get back into breeding rats (I can't now because I literally have no space left in the house to even put a 20g tank.) when my husband and I rent/buy a house, I'm going to breed for color, pattern, and coat type in my rats. I just have to get good quality rodents this time. I might also breed mice for my snakes that eat mice. They are just so stinky!

ClarkeReptiles wrote:

See, I think I would actually enjoy breeding the rats because you can breed rats for color and pattern just like snakes, only they reproduce much faster. When I get back into breeding rats (I can't now because I literally have no space left in the house to even put a 20g tank.) when my husband and I rent/buy a house, I'm going to breed for color, pattern, and coat type in my rats. I just have to get good quality rodents this time. I might also breed mice for my snakes that eat mice. They are just so stinky!

I do play around with the rat genetics. I'm like you in thinking if I have to clean all the cages I might as well have as much fun as possible. I have dumbo, hairless, and several diferent colors and patterns. But with that being said it still sucks cleaning 80 plus rat tubs.

Yea, the cleaning sucks. What do you use for bedding? I used the wood pellets like they use for horse stalls and while that helped a lot with the smell, it got dusty really fast.

I use a Drynest pine shavings. It's a fine chopped pine.

I'll have to check that out when I start breeding rodents again.

Very well said Don! A very fun hobby can quickly turn miserable when someone takes on more than they are prepared to deal with.

Some customers can be very rewarding to work with Zues and give you the motivation to deal with the others. I do wish more customers today cared more quality and not price though. Price is important but no quality breeder, large or small, hobbyist or pro, can be expected to price match the "reptile mill", essentially dog mill equivalents, that consist of a few of the larger multi species online retailers.

Thanks for the article Don... I have thought of this before as we will start breeding this year and also want to start breeding rats... I guess lucky for me Miles doesnt have an exact full time job and makes his own schedule so that is an advantage for us. And with the Rats at my parents, I can check them when I get to my parents in the afternoons to pick up my daughter. But you point out a lot of good points... we love football LOL. Lucky for us right now our snake racks are in the back part of our living room so we can kill 2 birds with 1 stone.

I am glad someone posted this though. Sometimes I feel like some people just jump in without thinking or reading and it gets frustrating but then I guess it is just the excitement of it all

well i love my rats i dont have much of a life..... im either working (a lot), spending very little time with my wife (different work schedules), or taking care of my animals. i havent started breeding yet but i still spend around 4 hours a day with my animals. whether its playing with my rats, running with my dogs, holding my snakes, feeding or cleaning cages.... but i enjoy it VERY much. i even play with those damn dubia roaches. i love all my animals and i love every minute i spend with them no matter what im doing with them. the "work" with them lets me clear my head and calms me down, i dont know if ive said it yet..... but i love it, lol. i personally cant wait to start breeding my snakes and my rats..... im definitely gonna have to breed the different types of rats, i think they are pretty damn cool.

that is good to hear Ryan!. -- hooray for babies! lol.

[quote="ezekiel21"]i love all my animals and i love every minute i spend with them no matter what im doing with them. the "work" with them lets me clear my head and calms me down, i dont know if ive said it yet..... but i love it, lol.[quote]

Ryan feel free to stay and clean 80 or so tubs when you pick up your rats. You should be pretty calm with a clear head by the time you finish.

How long does it take you to clean 80 tubs? I was using tanks (big mistake) when I first bred rats and it took me forever!

If you weren't so far away, I'd come clean rats in exchange for feeders.

It's really not that bad. Between an hour or two depending on how motivated I am and if there are any water sippers acting up.

[quote="zues"][quote="ezekiel21"]i love all my animals and i love every minute i spend with them no matter what im doing with them. the "work" with them lets me clear my head and calms me down, i dont know if ive said it yet..... but i love it, lol.

Quote :

Ryan feel free to stay and clean 80 or so tubs when you pick up your rats. You should be pretty calm with a clear head by the time you finish.

HAHAHA, LMAO. i really wouldnt mind helping, or even doing it for you if you needed me to...... all you have to do is ask. i really do enjoy it what can i say..... im odd

Wow you wanna come clean some snake crap too?

lol, i said i liked doing the work...... not that i have time to clean all of vaherps' cages, lol.

ezekiel21 wrote:

lol, i said i liked doing the work...... not that i have time to clean all of vaherps' cages, lol.

Ahh come on! You can be a VaHerps Janitor too!

Focal X wrote:

ezekiel21 wrote:

lol, i said i liked doing the work...... not that i have time to clean all of vaherps' cages, lol.

Ahh come on! You can be a VaHerps Janitor too!

haha, nah that title is all yours

Supposed to be a TEAM Ryan... TEAMWORK.

Interesting points. I have tried to own pet rats before and found myself to be allergic to them. They can make a cage stink in a single day, too. When I first got into the ball python hobby, I bought one of every morph that became available (and affordable) to me. About a year later I sold/traded many of them because the food cost so much.

I have heard that raising rats doesn't always pay off either, and sometimes it costs more in time and money to raise your own than to just buy feeders in bulk at the shows.

For this reason I will remain a small scale breeder, and with the money I make from selling morphs, I will gradually upgrade my collection/projects while weeding out the "common" morphs to keep a very condensed/efficient collection!

DaganGecko wrote:

Interesting points. I have tried to own pet rats before and found myself to be allergic to them. They can make a cage stink in a single day, too. When I first got into the ball python hobby, I bought one of every morph that became available (and affordable) to me. About a year later I sold/traded many of them because the food cost so much.

I have heard that raising rats doesn't always pay off either, and sometimes it costs more in time and money to raise your own than to just buy feeders in bulk at the shows.

For this reason I will remain a small scale breeder, and with the money I make from selling morphs, I will gradually upgrade my collection/projects while weeding out the "common" morphs to keep a very condensed/efficient collection!

I spend about 150-175 bucks a month on food and bedding and about 4-5 hours a week. I wholesale about 200 dollars worth of pinkies and crawlers every month. So basicly my rats pay for themselves and my 30+ snakes have a free all they can eat buffet that I know is healthy and well taken care of. I agree breeding rodents is only a good idea if you have a 10-15 plus snakes. If I wasn't selling any rats I could cut my production in half and still come out ahead. I couldn't buy food for 30 snakes at shows for 75 bucks a month.

Thats the problem we have with 17 mouths to feed right now. That is why it is a big deal for us to breed our own rats... to cut back on costs and so that we have what we need when we need it and we know it is healthy... it is very expensive to feed...

i buy my rats for now, but i plan on breeding in the near future (im gonna need a rack or two very soon). i cant wait to start breeding my rats, the guy i get mine from now is a real jerk, lol

I resent that. I even offered to let you clean my cages.

I really want to start breeding rats too, but for now, I have no room (you should see my snake room, I literally have NO room left) I buy from Rodent Pro for now.

We don't have room either. That is why we are "renting" part of my parents garage... lol

Thats why I buy them dont want the work of having to care for them. frozen and rodent pro is the way to go.

We bred rats for a little while, we wound up selling them off with most of our snake collection when the fiance enlisted.

But I really appreciate this post, and all other articles like it. They really put things in perspective for people who are working towards breeding. So thank you very, very much for the words of wisdom c: